Fanny Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> I think Obama and Biden should stick to what
> attracted people to them in the first place,
> courteousy and real/sincere motivation to bring
> change in people s' life. I don't think it is a
> good strategy to give in to the path of
> dishonorable attacks chosen by McCain. I don't
> think it will resonnate well in viewers mind
> (indpendant and undecided). The reason why Obama
> and Biden did better in the debates is because of
> course, they have more substance in theireconomic
> plans and they offer more strategies to help the
> country besides war and more war but also because
> they appeared to be more civil and less desperate
> to win at all costs, by all means.
> Let the McCain campaign dig their own pit and let
> America and world see how nasty and hypocrite this
> ticket is. Obama's gain in the polls is not
> entirely due to the economy. I think people like
> their personnality so they should focus on
> remaining cool.
> As for Palin's racist and twisted comments, I
> advise her to leave her faded christianity behind
> her. I don't know under which banner she is
> running but certainly not under Jesus Christ's..

I think McCain waited too long to bring up these obvious glaring character issues tha the MSM has tried to minimize since hillary was on the ropes. It's about time. The man who's only appeal was his smile and the perception that he was an honest, forthwright, UNASSUMING persona that could bring together all parties, races, creeds. That is what attracted me to Obama until we learned that his past deeds told us otherwise. Whether its his LONG TERM relationships with Ayers, Rezco, Wright, Phleger, his socialist roots and strong beliefs in the ways of Saul Alinsky and following of his communist uncle's way in Hawaii...they all point in the exact opposite direction to the type of person the MSM and his campaign is PAINTING him to be. Like one big game of sherades. No sale here Mr. Obama, although I have to hand it to you...you have fooled probably enough lemmings to get you over the top.

Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> No Country for Old Men

> I have only one conclusion:
>
> An Obama presidency will be a launching pad to
> cement the democratic party into a virtual
> monopoly on political power over the American
> nation which might likely last for generations.
> And, such a monopoly could likely, permanently
> change the nature of the American nation,
> overturning it’s traditions which transformed a
> wilderness continent into the strongest, most
> vibrant nation on earth, and the saving grace of
> the world for the past two centuries.
>
> Truly, it will be “No Country for Old Men”. Or
> young men, either.


I think your conclusion is a bit off. The transformation of this country was made by men and women, black, white, hispanic, religious and non-religious, boisterous and meek, Republican and democrat and independent.

This country could have been destroyed once or twice maybe more times before and it was always because of market anarchists and laissez-faireists whotake the idea of laissez-faire to its extreme by opposing all compulsory state intervention including taxation, preferring that law and order be privately funded or as close to no controls as they can get by with.

The current economic crisis and the Great Depression was caused by these policies of "hands off" every prosperous era for America came when the government intervened for the good of the full population.

Like any system of government success lies in the development of the grass roots base of a country. We did that with education, jobs, community support and allowing companies to grow. The Democratic party never inhibited corporate profit only the kind of market control those companies held over new endeavors. "Fair trade" will always succeed for everyone "Free Trade" will only succeed for the few.

No Country for Old Men

The following is my answer to another poster on a message board which follows the stock of a small wind turbine company. The posters are a long time established group, familiar with each other, and occasionally they get into political discussions. One of the posters told me that I should write as a commentator. Well, that’s not going to happen, but I thought I would post this on a political discussion board, where it might create some interest.

The exchange started when I said I might move to Iceland or Croatia if Obama gets elected. I have embellished my response to make a fuller case, and I am known as a very lengthy writer. So, read this if you have the wherewithal to get through a long post.


RICHIE:

Anchorcheck, get a grip. It would take a massive switch to get McCain elected, now.

You need to quit watching FIX news. Could you repeat your claim that you would move to Iceland if Obama gets elected, for the record?


ANCHORCHECK:

Richie, it may look grim for McCain this past week, but I just read an article pointing out that there has already been a couple of massive swings in the polls over the past many weeks.

Remember the "Bradley Effect", too. Try running those interactive electoral maps I posted by adding in 3 to 5 points for McCain in the battleground states. I have. McCain wins. Maybe even big.

And then there is the potential movement back to McCain. Americans just might still be having some considerable misgivings about Obama, as he still remains hopelessly vague and quite a mystery man, with little accomplishment.

Is Obama the most hard left candidate to ever run for the presidency? I think the answer is easily yes. This is why the democrats are insisting that looking into Obama’s past is “not fair”, or dirty politics. But, they sent a few score of lawyers up to Alaska to try to uncover dirt on Palin, yet her past has been pretty much an open book. Obama’s past is filled with radical activist and socialist associations. And that is what is being hidden. And the media has simply ignored this glaring issue.

The democrat’s mantra is "No more Bush!". We have heard that stupid mantra from the Bush haters for years and years. It is quite tiresome and silly, and maybe, just maybe, voters are not capitulating into lockstep with these democrat’s delusions that Bush is the devil. Some of the democrats even want to try Bush for war crimes! Thus, it appears that many of the hard left democrats, even Pelosi, suffer from ABDS (Anti-Bush Dysfunction Syndrome).

Voters may simply not believe that McCain and Bush are linked, or that there is anything really relevant about hating Bush. As Sarah Palin pointed out in her debate, trying to link McCain to hatred of Bush is just looking backwards. We need to move on. This election is about the future. The country faces big issues, and needs sober leadership.

Iraq is not really an issue anymore. Essentially, we have won, you know. The “Surge” accomplished this, which McCain bravely pushed, while the democrats brayed that Iraq was an American defeat, and put it front and center as the issue which they would use to win the coming presidential election.

Well, that scenario didn’t work the way the democrats thought it would.

Now, with Iraq, we just need to ensure that we don’t snatch defeat from the jaws of victory, and withdraw abruptly and give the terrorists a chance to undue what our soldiers sacrificed for. That would be a travesty for those brave young men and women who fought and some who died.

Then there is the factor of the voter’s tradition of not giving one party both the presidency AND the legislative branch. And you do recall that the Congress has a favorable rating close to that of Hitler during the battle of Berlin, don't you? Is it in the single digits yet? Pelosi is a dried up Wicked Witch of the West compared to our perky Sarah Palin. Sarah could be wearing ruby slippers, maybe, and just needs to click her heels together to make things better.

Pelosi actually turned out the lights in Congress on those republican congressmen who wanted to debate the issue of drilling for oil and gas right here in America! She did this even knowing that, clearly, the vast majority of Americans want to “drill baby drill!”. I think the democrats are so enamored of politically correct ideology, that they actually want oil prices to remain high, just to make their pet alternative energy projects more competitive with oil and gas produced right here in America! And, unlike Palin and McCain, the democrats just don’t want nuclear energy revived. The democrats were the ones who killed the nuclear energy industry 30 years ago. Now here we are with no nuclear pants being built in the past 30 years, and France gets 80% of their energy from nuclear! That’s what aligning yourself with the environmental extremists got them…...and, unfortunately, us too!

Everyone is for SANE alternative energy. But the logical response to our energy crisis is to use true science to find the best methods to transition to them, not politically correct ideology which seeks to jettison oil, gas, coal and nuclear energy. That is just insane.

I am hoping that some type of "Swift Boat" campaign will soon be launched to bring out the exceedingly strange background of your hero, Obama. The media certainly is not doing their job in examining Obama’s past. You do realize that he has actually had very little experience in governance, quite a bit less than Palin, who the democrats decry as being woefully unqualified…..for the VICE presidency!

Go look up and compare Palin’s political career and Obama’s on Wikipedia. Palin started her governmental career in 1992 on the Wasila City counsel board. Obama was a leftist political activist in Chicago at that time. Palin then became mayor of Wasila for two terms, while it wasn’t until 1997 that Obama became a state legislator in Springfield, the Illinois capital. Obama served as a state legislator to 2004, then ran for US senator. He won that race when his campaign successfully got the divorce records of his opponent released publicly, and it was revealed that his opponent had asked his wife to accompany him to a sex club. Obama’s opponent had to withdraw from the race over the embarrassment, and Obama won easily in the disarray of his opponent’s candidacy.

Obama began his senate term in January 2005. In February of 2007 he began his campaign for the presidency.

Palin’s record is pretty well known, by now, with all the scrutiny. Her record has been quite transparent, I think. When she won her campaign for governor of Alaska on a reform ticket, she beat the incumbent republican governor in the primary, and then went on to beat a former democratic governor of Alaska, even though she was greatly outspent by him. Early in her governorship, her favorable ratings were polled as high as 93%, and she still remains the most popular governor in the US, by far.

Here is a question for you. Has there ever been a less qualified candidate for president as Obama? Has there ever been a candidate which even remotely approaches Obama's apparent extreme radical background?

You democrats are trying to sabotage Governor Palin across the internet and the media as being a stupid hick from Alaska. But, she clearly has more practical, as well as executive experience, than Obama.

Obama's main experience appears to be a very fluid familiarity with all things radical, leftist, politically correct, and blackly militant. Somehow, I don't view that type of background as being useful or relevant. In fact, I, and I am sure most Americans, view that type of a background as being a DISQUALIFICATION to be president.

That 20 year dalliance in the Black Liberation, "hate whitey" church fits very neatly within Obama's history. I am looking for the "swift boat" to properly "out" this arrogant leftist in sheep's clothing. Then lets do the polls.

The media has simply had a “hands off” approach to reporting Obama’s disturbing background. But, you can find plenty about it on the internet. Here’s two links:

An "Obama Timeline" at:
http://[colony14.net]/id41.html

A sobering list of "What Obama would do..." at:
http://[colony14.net]/id35.html


There has been very little of an expose of Obama which has not been "swiftly" minimalized by the Obama fawning media. Take Obama’s association with the former Weatherman terrorist, Bill Ayers. The media has just dismissed Obama’s quite extensive history with this man. From my reading, Obama was heavily involved with Bill Ayers in giving tens of millions of dollars to schools through a foundation which had been set up to improve education for kids in Chicago. I’m sure it was never the donor’s intent to do this, but Obama and Ayers and their colleagues set it up so that all that money was channeled to schools ONLY through a filter of radical leftist organizations, which the schools were forced to associate with, and programs were set up to use the funds to teach kids about leftist community organizing tactics, and America’s supposed racial and social injustices. Requests for funds by schools to this foundation to teach math and science were ignored by Obama and Ayers and the foundation they ran together.

Go look this up on the internet yourself. Maybe I got some of the details wrong, but this was the gist of what I recall. It was called the Annenberg Foundation, I believe.

Another point is that we have just had the worst run of economic news since the depression, and its conceivable that things will quiet down for a few weeks before more shoes drop. But, make no mistake that we are facing big challenges in the economic system.

Putting a radical like Obama in the presidency combined with Pelosi in control of the Congress, and Biden in control of the Senate, could just give them a once in a hundred year opportunity to use the country’s worrisome economic straights to permanently change the free enterprise system to a hard left socialist system, which is what Russia, China, and Eastern Europe only recently rejected. Socialism and communism just doesn’t work, and the Chinese, Russians and Poles know this through bitter experience, and finally kicked socialism to the curb.

How Ironic if Reagan and Thatcher finally gave the knock out blow to communism, only to have a new drive towards socialism emerge here a few decades later! It is said that the only place where one can still find Marxists is on the campuses of America and Europe. Most of them are sporting grey pony tails.

I admit, it looks grim for McCain at present, but it ain't over yet. I am very worried, though.

It does look as though Obama will breeze through the election, with essentially no serious background check having been done on him by the media. And, it is amazing that the media is doing such a hatchet job on Alaskan Governor Sarah Palin, while giving a total pass to Obama on even glancing at his strange past.

Eventually, you won't like what you get with an Obama presidency, if Obama breezes to his victory, and gets to have his personalized presidential seal painted on air force one. (Frankly, I find this just as disturbing as Obama’s radical past, that he would take the time to design his own, personalized, presidential seal. This smacks of some kind of extreme egotism or arrogance).

Finally, Obama has one other factor going against him. The democrats have a bunch of little lunatic bloggers and activists who are constantly being mobilized to haunt the call in shows, or to literally SHOUT DOWN the opposition. This happened to the Milt Rosenberg radio show in Chicago when he interviewed an author who has carefully researched Obama’s past. And Milt Rosenberg is a gracious, extraordinarily gifted intellect, and is regarded as one of the smartest men living on the planet today. I have listened to him for a few decades. He is a retired University of Chicago professor of sociology, and a true gift to our country. He has interviewed the likes of Henry Kissenger, Margaret Thatcher, and a myriad of noted authors and intellectuals, and other people of note over the past 30 years he has been on the radio. He even had Obama on his program a few years ago.

Obama’s operatives were instructed to shut down Milt’s interview with this author, and they literally flooded the Tribune’s radio station, WGN, with demands to not carry the interview, and then flooded this call in show with callers when WGN went ahead with it anyway. You can go to wgnradio.com, and click on the Milt Rosenberg show, and look up the archived program where this occurred. Milt archives most of his shows. They are very good.

Milt was aghast at the activity which was swirling around his broadcast, and the episode made the national news. But, Milt didn’t cave in to the Obamabots, as some have nicknamed them.

People see through these type of stalinist tactics. It is not attractive, and people get fed up quickly with it. Who would want to be governed by these pests, anyway? Legions of them would infest our government in an Obama presidency.

Maybe Obama was one of these agitators when he started out his career as a ‘community organizer’, using the tactics invented by the communist activist Saul Alinsky. I think this was the case if you dig into Obama’s past on the internet.

If McCain wins yet, there will be a massive sigh of relief across this nation. You simply do not realize how people purposefully hide their more traditionalist views from public view. They have been conditioned to hide, and only whisper their true views to people that they feel are safe to expose themselves to. Things may be becoming somewhat like living in East Germany when people were careful not to reveal themselves to potential Stassi informants. I think it could get worse; much, much worse under an Obama presidency combined with the democrat party in control of most other institutions.

Remember, when Obama takes the presidency, the hard left democrats will also control the following:

Congress
Senate
Judiciary
TV Media
Most "Talking Head" commentators
Newspapers and magazines
Environmental Cause Organizations
Women's Lib Organizations
Gay Rights Organizations
ACLU
Other Activist Organizations
Hollywood
Kindergarten schools
Grade Schools
High Schools
Universities
Teachers Unions
Government Workers Unions
General Unions
Some Liberal Churches
National Public Radio
Public TV
Most Charitable Organizations
The United Nations
Many European National Governments
The European Union
Most Actors, Comics, and Musician Celebrities
etc.....add your own…


The only institution that the conservatives have is talk radio, and Nancy Pelosi has vowed to shut that down once Obama takes the presidency.

If there is some type of modern day "Bradley Effect", I suspect it will have more to do with an aversion to political correctness than it does with not being willing to vote for a black candidate.

Finally, regarding my saying I would move to Iceland if Obama is elected, that will not be easily accomplished. So, no promises. But, if I were a young man, and Obama were elected, I would absolutely be making every effort to leave this country. You democrats have simply destroyed it. Your party leaders and a large contingent of its voters are simply viscous, malcontent zealots, who will stop at NOTHING to get your way of transforming this country into your foggy notion of a socialist nirvana.

A young man can build a new life in some other country where sanity prevails, and political zealots don't patrol the airwaves, streets, and halls of government power.

If by some miracle, Americans wake up before they elect this charlatan Obama to the presidency, I am sure that there will be epithets of racism hissed through clenched teeth, and a massive screaming wail of protest from the democrats, like a spoiled brat, red faced, jumping up and down, who didn't get her way, despite using her wiliest schemes and tactics. Eight years of vilifying Bush, wishing for the worst in Iraq, bashing the USA, etc, etc.......and all for naught!!

Then, the nightmare beast of the democratic party and the political correctness goons will soon gear up for the next political Armageddon, plotting more voter fraud, and enfranchising more voters from the ranks of the felons, illegal aliens and what not. They NEVER stop. They are indefatigable. They are like a hideous pink bunny, constantly on the march. They keep going, and going, and going…….

One very key difference between the republicans and the democrats is that republicans are just a political party, and if they win an election, they step into govern the country. The democrats, on the other hand, are a true political movement and machine. They view themselves as a PROFESSIONAL governing class and a mighty, unstoppable cause that is destined, by right, to govern the country, and to impose their vision of a perfected state of governance.

This is a deadly serious cause for democrats, and few democratic party operatives have any desire for anything other than a political career. They are apparatchiks, and have no desire for a life outside of political governance. This is the reason that the democrats behave the way they do, and will literally stop at nothing to achieve power. And once they are in power, they will use every lever of government to retain power, to cement their rule. This is why voter fraud, which I think most Americans look upon as anathema, is viewed as simply a necessary tactic by democrats. It is one means to what they regard as an absolutely critical end; their ascension to power.

Republicans, if they lose an election, just go home and go back to their families and the private sector. It is not the end of the world for them, at all.

This country has been transformed by the democrats and the massive political correctness mania which has ensnared every institution I listed above.

The movie "No Country for Old Men" said it all. The main character in the movie, an old Texas lawman nearing the end of his career, finds that he can barely recognize the country he knew as a young man. The movie focused on the drug trade along the Texas-Mexican border as the evil he confronted, along with the broader degradation of society.

But, to me, beyond the obvious disintegration of civic society in all manner which has occurred , another evil which has transformed the nation is the ruthless drive to political power which the democrats have exhibited over the past few decades, increasing in its ferocity with each election cycle. It seems that the democrats will literally stop at nothing to gain power. Whether it is a war in Iraq which they seemed to have taken a “see I told you so” glee when they assumed that we would lose, or the current economic dire circumstances we face, some of which can reasonably be laid at their feet, they never miss the chance to turn events into propaganda for their cause. It is truly despicable.

I have only one conclusion:

An Obama presidency will be a launching pad to cement the democratic party into a virtual monopoly on political power over the American nation which might likely last for generations. And, such a monopoly could likely, permanently change the nature of the American nation, overturning it’s traditions which transformed a wilderness continent into the strongest, most vibrant nation on earth, and the saving grace of the world for the past two centuries.

Truly, it will be “No Country for Old Men”. Or young men, either.

The Guilt By Association Game
by BarbinMD
Sun Oct 05, 2008 at 02:15:12 PM PDT

As discussed here earlier, with John McCain facing the prospect of getting his ass handed to him in November, he has decided that the mavericky thing to do is to swift boat Barack Obama by playing the guilt by association game. Great idea, Senator Straight Talk...but it's no fun to play alone, so let's add a couple of more players:

There's McCain's association with G. Gordon Liddy:

Liddy served four and a half years in prison in connection with his conviction for his role in the Watergate break-in and the break-in at the office of the psychiatrist of Daniel Ellsberg, the military analyst who leaked the Pentagon Papers. Liddy has acknowledged preparing to kill someone during the Ellsberg break-in "if necessary"; plotting to murder journalist Jack Anderson; plotting with a "gangland figure" to murder Howard Hunt to stop him from cooperating with investigators; plotting to firebomb the Brookings Institution; and plotting to kidnap "leftist guerillas" at the 1972 Republican National Convention -- a plan he outlined to the Nixon administration using terminology borrowed from the Nazis. (The murder, firebombing, and kidnapping plots were never carried out; the break-ins were.) During the 1990s, Liddy reportedly instructed his radio audience on multiple occasions on how to shoot Bureau of Alcohol, Tobacco, and Firearms agents and also reportedly said he had named his shooting targets after Bill and Hillary Clinton.

Liddy has donated $5,000 to McCain's campaigns since 1998, including $1,000 in February 2008. In addition, McCain has appeared on Liddy's radio show during the presidential campaign, including as recently as May. An online video labeled "John McCain On The G. Gordon Liddy Show 11/8/07" includes a discussion between Liddy and McCain, whom Liddy described as an "old friend." During the segment, McCain praised Liddy's "adherence to the principles and philosophies that keep our nation great," said he was "proud" of Liddy, and said that "it's always a pleasure for me to come on your program."

Point: McCain

And from Paul Begala:

But John McCain sat on the board of a very right-wing organization, it was the U.S. Council for World Freedom, it was chaired by a guy named John Singlaub, who wound up involved in the Iran contra scandal. It was an ultra conservative, right-wing group. The Anti-Defamation League, in 1981 when McCain was on the board, said this about this organization. It was affiliated with the World Anti-Communist League – the parent organization – which ADL said "has increasingly become a gathering place, a forum, a point of contact for extremists, racists and anti-Semites."

Point: McCain

And we can't forget the mini-Maverick and her close and personal relationship with an America-hating secessionist group:

So, we have Sarah Palin, actively involved with a secessionist group that professes its hatred for America, and whose husband was a card-carrying member of the group for seven years. And don't forget, Todd Palin isn't just the spouse of an elected official. He has been called a Shadow Governor, attending private meetings, being sent on fact finding trips, and being copied on emails that were later "prohibited from being released to the public due to executive privilege." This man would be a 72-year old heartbeat and a pillow away from the presidency.

Point: Palin

And let's add Palin's pesky, but largely ignored, preacher problem. Thomas Muthee, the preacher that Palin said helped her become governor:

...founded his ministry with a witchhunt against a Kenyan woman who he accused of causing car accidents through demonic spells.

And while praying with Palin standing by his side, Muthee:

...implored Jesus to protect Palin from "the spirit of witchcraft." The video archive of that startling sermon was scrubbed from Wasilla Assembly of God’s website, but now it has reappeared.

And during that same prayer, Muthee also said:

The second area whereby God wants us, wants to penetrate in our society is in the economic area. The Bible says that the wealth of the wicked is stored up for the righteous. It's high time that we have top Christian businessmen, businesswomen, bankers, you know, who are men and women of integrity running the economics of our nations. That's what we are waiting for. That's part and parcel of transformation. If you look at the -- you know -- if you look at the Israelites, that's how they work. And that's how they are, even today.

Yes, Palin listened to him calling for God to take banking and business out of the hands of Jews and later praised him and his sermon.

Point: Palin

Oh, and one more that we can't forget. John McCain's association with four men...in fact, if it wasn't for John McCain's intimate association with them, the Savings & Loan crisis that cost the American taxpayers $2.6 billion, would have been known as the Keating 4 instead of the Keating 5 scandal:

The Keating Five became synonymous for the kind of political influence that money can buy. As the S&L failure deepened, the sheer magnitude of the losses hit the press. Billions of dollars had been squandered. The five senators were linked as the gang who shilled for an S&L bandit.

S&L "trading cards" came out. The Keating Five card showed Charles Keating holding up his hand, with a senator's head adorning each finger. McCain was on Keating's pinkie.

Point: McCain

And on the other side we have Barack Obama who served on charitable boards, along with many others, with William Ayers, who was involved with a radical group when Obama was 8 years old. Oh, and they share a zip code.

Point: Zero

And the winner is, McCain and Palin. But when you think about it, this game really isn't fair. While Obama had no association with Ayers' radical past and has repeatedly denounced it, both McCain and Palin were personally involved with all of their players. But let's let them enjoy their victory here. It's the only one they'll get.

Back to the topic. Joe Biden did fine showing he is a friend and understands Joe Six-Pack - Sarah Perch proved she can't answer direct questions. Oh I'm sure she can if they let her be herself but they are afraid who she is isn't what Americans want as a Vice President. So she can only answer questions she has memorized the answers; whether they are the questions asked or not. No she is no match for Joe Biden.

“Master Debater”, A Haiku



Smart Sarah Stumbles,

Beehive Bimbo Blathers Bull,

Right, Rednecks Rave.

Terry McPartland Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Terry McPartland Wrote: Then buy higher
> taxes [[[Not for me or anyone else making under $250,000]]],by a lot,

Capital gains, [[[Explain why "capital gains" is never followed by a complete explaination]]]
Health care to pay for illegal immigrants and all by employers[[[Didn't we have many years of Republican rule to get this straightened out and the US Chamber of Commerce and George W. fighting to get nothing done, well the bubbas -as the Republicans call them and the NASCAR dads need to look at who they have been voting for]]]
> sending more jobs off shore with these guys in power. [[[I'm sure it must be the democrats, illegals, blacks and unemployed workers sending jobs over seas]]]

Do Unions create jobs? No, Business owners do. [[[Workers in Unions create the products and services that had and still could make us the greatest power in the world. If the workers hadn't done their jobs business owners could not make a profit beyond a mom and pop operation. ]]]

<No tax increase less than $250,00o? Oh
> really, what is 7 plus percent FICA with no cap?
> patriotic. Two of the most liberal Washington and
> Political left leaners in 70 years. [[[You tell me, please be specific I really want to know. Buddy left leaning? Who got names? I hate to tell you but what you right (Right, not meaning correct) leaning folks refuse to understand is that many of your views were extremist until recently. Ronald Reagan's assault on worker's was the beginning of the decimation of American values that placed the workers of this country as the producers of value. Democrats are known for standing up for the people of Main street and always have since FDR had to rescue the country from the Republican excesses that led to the Great Depression. It was the rank and file little guy who FDR put back to work in great numbers who again made this country Great. Those must be the left leaners you talk about if so thanks for the compliment]]]

Terry, you better get back to school. But don't let the facts get in your way.

>Oh ,love immigrants just not illegals. [[[Can you tell the difference?]]]

pviel Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Joe Biden Was No Match for 'Joe Six-Pack'? Oh
> really Peggy!
>
>
> As far as Mrs. Palin was concerned, Gwen Ifill was
> not there, and Joe Biden was not there. Sarah and
> the camera were there.
>
> Peggy, people watched the debate to see a debate
> on issues. That's the point of a debate. Ignoring
> Gwen Ifill is exactly like the people we all talk
> to and it becomes obvious they are not listening
> to us of care what we think. This may be good for
> the base but it turns off those who truly are
> trying to decide who they will vote for in the
> election. So I guess she got your vote but then
> she already had that.
>
> She said of his intentions on Iraq, "Say it ain't
> so Joe, your plan is a white flag of surrender."
> The Bush administration, John McCain and now Sarah
> never defined victory because there is no real
> goal only war for war's sake. General Petreaus
> already said there is no place to plant a flag.
> For once I'd like to hear the Republicans tell
> America why all the soldiers and Iraqi Citizens
> died and just what is the victory other than
> turning over the country of Iraq over to the
> people of Iraq - isn't that leaving?
>
> The heart of her message was a complete populist
> pitch. "Joe Six-Pack" and "soccer moms" should
> unite to fight the tormentors who forced mortgages
> on us. She spoke of "Main Streeters like me." A
> question is at what point shiny, happy populism
> becomes cheerful manipulation.
>
> If I were a millionaire do you think dropping the
> "G" from words endin' in "ing" would help me
> better understand main street or the side streets
> of America.
>
> Well I'm just a poor ol' country boy in Oregon who
> grew up in Texas with small town values attending
> religious schools from kendydarten through high
> school who and I ain't buyin' her act.

Thanks for the insights Ms. "Its Over" Noonan.

Keep on whistling through the graveyard of McCain's failed campaign.

Election 2008 Obama McCain Spread
RCP National Average 49.2 43.4 Obama +5.8
Favorable Ratings +20.2 +10.8 Obama +9.4
Intrade Market Odds 70.8 29.3

Electoral College Obama McCain Spread
RCP Electoral Count 264 163 Obama +101
No Toss Up States 353 185 Obama +168

Battleground States Obama McCain Spread
Colorado 49.0 44.6 Obama +4.4
Ohio 48.0 46.0 Obama +2.0
Florida 48.6 45.6 Obama +3.0
Pennsylvania 49.9 42.0 Obama +7.9
Missouri 46.8 48.5 McCain +1.7
Virginia 49.0 46.6 Obama +2.4

P.S. He'll be losing Missouri as well soon enough.

All - Biden habitually lied in the debate. I checked the facts on the web. I don't even think he knows that he lies. It may be an unconsious a problem for him.

All things considered - Sarah won. She was more likeable and ordinary. She spoke directly to ordinary Americans. She was very Reagan-like. If Biden did not mistrue the facts so much, then perhaps he would have won.

Peggy, please! Go with your initial reaction to Palin's pick. It was a disaster, only surpassed by McCain's missteps of the last two weeks.

Since when does claiming to be a populist the sole criterion for being one?

Palin is and was the same person: well trained in the art of delivering precanned lines, whether they be through a teleprompter, or through a few sessions of cramming catch phrases. An inexperienced hack devoid of all intellectual curiosity otherwise. It is insulting to Joe six-pack to claim that Palin represents him.

It'd also help if the self-proclaimed populist answered the questions that were asked.

It is like a spelling contest where the contestants prepare by cramming dictionaries. You need to know how to spell the word, but it is not essential that

"Ms. Palin, the word is INTELLECTUAL"

"Doggone it Gwen, I am not going to spell that word, I want to spell the word that Americans want to hear, because I am a populist and I will speak to them directly"

"E-C-C-L-E-S-I-A-S-T-I-C-A-L. Ecclesiastical"

Palin has a lot of words memorized, but knows little of what they mean. Which is why she can string a bunch of verbiage, use time, and make no sense.

It was sickening when self-proclamation first arrived in sports, it is worse when someone who could be our President in the next couple of years overuses it.